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Discussion for Vegas veterans re: Non-gamblers

Boston
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Discussion for Vegas veterans re: Non-gamblers

Over the past several months, I have seen more and more posters on this forum who are planning to visit Vegas as non-gamblers. Either they really will not gamble at all, or they will at most stick a $5 bill in a slot machine and call it a day.

The problem with this is that gambling revenue in Vegas is way down. People who come and take advantage of the cheap hotel rooms but don't give anything back through gambling will, in large enough numbers, cause problems for the industry. This will result in fewer discounts and comps for those of us who do gamble.

I say this as someone who might well be considered a low roller by many here, and someone who pays for my hotel rooms and rarely gets a comped night. The point is not how much you "contribute", it's that you do contribute at whatever level you can afford. Simply paying for your hotel room does not begin to cover the actual cost of your stay at current rates.

Of course, you can't force people to gamble. But I wonder whether the casinos, and also we on this forum, should be encouraging non-gamblers to visit Las Vegas. The casinos might be better off raising their rack rates but giving greater discounts and comps to those who gamble.

The only reason I even bring this up is the serious financial straits the casinos are in. MGM/Mirage, Harrah's, and Sands are all flying by the seat of their pants right now. If business were booming then I wouldn't care whether anyone else gambles or not.

Just trying to generate some discussion. Flame away.

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The Mirage Hotel & Casino
The Mirage Hotel & Casino
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Las Vegas, NV
texas
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51. Re: Discussion for Vegas veterans re: Non-gamblers

What are they doing if they are not playing. If they are not going to the shows, if they are not shopping or taking tours?

Thay are the thousands and thousands of the sidewalk Zombies, We have all seen them, been walked into by them, had them stop dead in thier tracks right infront of you completely without warning or reason, while forcing you dodge them like a running back in the superbowl inorder to avoid a train wreck of a collision.

They are the ones with the glazed over look and deadman's stare, completely oblivious to anything going on around them.

We're not big players, usually 5 or6 hundered a night between us. But yeah I would like to see more focus on the player, The way it used to be. Thank God for old man Binion. Keep Orlando, Disney, Unversal studios, Gatlinburg and so many other wonderfull Family places for the Family.

Vegas should never have tried to become Six Flags in the first place.

And keep Vegas for Vegas The Gamblin town for the Gambler. Seemy side and all, $1.99 breakfast at noon

smokey casinos, creatures of the night, even the cold hard concrete sidewalk on a bad night and thick roll of C-notes when the dice hot and the drinks are cold.

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Orlando
Orlando
Central Florida, FL
Gatlinburg
Gatlinburg
Sevier County, TN
Barrie Ontario
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52. Re: Discussion for Vegas veterans re: Non-gamblers

No one goes a way and spends no money isn't a dollar spent a dollar spent?

Economics? Are you kidding me? The greater occupancy means the overhead is shared amongst more guests, means better per guest profit. Also it employs more people who have more money to spend and pay more taxes and so on and so on...

us
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53. Re: Discussion for Vegas veterans re: Non-gamblers

I do not thnk the % of non-gamblers has incresed over the past several months - it has over the last decade or so.

When LV was trying to attract families clearly they knew all those kids wouldn't gamble.

Non-gambling revenue has increased as a % of income for the casinos over the years.

the casinos don't need posters on TA to figure out what to do.

Del Mar, California
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54. Re: Discussion for Vegas veterans re: Non-gamblers

I didn't read many of the reply but I have been going to Vegas since 1984(I was 14 years old at the time) and I have been gambling since I was 19 years old(casinos didn't card people as much in 1989) and I used to be able to play 25 cent slots for 4 hours a day on $40 but now the $40 MIGHT last 1 hour so I don't even bother throwing my money away gambling anymore. I may spend $40 on gambling for however long it lasts. I also generally won't pay $10-$12 for a drink in the casino, bars, lounges either.

I love Steve Wynns hotels all the way from the Mirage on up to Wynn but I remeber around 1990-1992 Sam's Town which at the time was a HUGE locals casino in Vegas started posting billboards all around Las Vegas saying "come to Sams Town where our slot pay-outs aren't a Mirage" or something similar. So ever since the Mirage opened in 1989 the trend has become tighter and tighter slots as each year passes so if people don't gamble I can't blame them at all.

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The Mirage Hotel & Casino
The Mirage Hotel & Casino
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Wynn Las Vegas
Wynn Las Vegas
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Yankee
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55. Re: Discussion for Vegas veterans re: Non-gamblers

I realize that the gamblers subsidize my hotel rooms in Vegas. Thank you.

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Dallas
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56. Re: Discussion for Vegas veterans re: Non-gamblers

I remember my first trip to Vegas in 1983 and several trips into the ninties. Before all the mega resorts the rooms were cheap, the Casino/Hotel owned all the restrauants and had cheap but good food. They all made money and were happy, the guest were happy. I am a low roller (100/200 per day) but I rember the feeling of being treated like a high roller anyway. I spent just a little on food, shows, room, then the rest went to gambling. Of course for the past few years Vegas has not been intrested in me or my fellow low rollers. I believe that most people have the same budget for vacation now as they did back then when you figure cost of living into the equation. But my last trip in 2005 when Las Vegas was on a roll it seems like most of my money went for room and food and little to play with. I spent the same amount of money as I aleays did but did not feel like I got my moneys worth, did not have that welcome feeling, hard to explain beyond that. We are booked in the Mandalay Bay second week of June for $65 per night. I feel like that is a bargian again. We are going to drive from Dallas instead of fly this time to see some of the sights we have not seen since we drove there on our honeymoon in 1984. Looking forward to the trip and will post my first trip report on return. I do not no if the mega resorts buisness model ever planned for down times when they seemed to run off the players like myself in faver of the free spending younger crowed, we will see.

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Mandalay Bay Resort & Casino
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Dallas
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Park Forest...
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57. Re: Discussion for Vegas veterans re: Non-gamblers

The way I see it, Vegas in general and MGM in particular chose this path. The theory was diversification including the pursuit of non-gambling business was supposed to tide them over through periods like this. What makes it even worse is that many gamblers stopped feeling welcome in Vegas between the focus on dining and ultralounges, poor gaming conditions and the overall sense of being nickled and dimed to death.

So, now non-gamblers are spending little money and that money is not even spent in the hotel where they are staying. And there are gamblers who used to come to Vegas several times a year (AND CAN STILL AFFORD TO NOW) who have started to fall in love with regional casinos and stay at locals casinos or Laughlin when they do return to Nevada.

It doesn't make sense to offer really cheap rooms to just anyone off the street. It is cheaper to let the casino have empty rooms.

lasvegassun.com/news/…

If they are going to pursue a course of filling the hotel at any loss, then the casinos should at least do everything they can to keep the guests in the hotel eating at its restaurants, seeing its shows and using its services. That is something they used to do and I don't understand why they can't return to that. Even if they don't own those parts of the hotel, they do at least get some type of cut.

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St. John's, Canada
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58. Re: Discussion for Vegas veterans re: Non-gamblers

Some of us enjoy a good debate while others are offended or intend to offend...oh well, it's all good!

To fuel the fire - I wonder how much the fancy stores and restaurants pay for rent? I assume it would be steep, plus a % of their revenue - cha ching!

If it wasn't for the value of strip real estate, MGM, HET, and others may be far worse off than they are now.

Park Forest...
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59. Re: Discussion for Vegas veterans re: Non-gamblers

They are worse off than they were and the value of real estate is a source of the problem. Compare the selling price of New Frontier, which was essentially 1.2B for just the land compared to the sale of TI, which was $775M less a $20M discount for cash for the land and the casino operation. I don't know what the Tropicana was priced at when Aztar was sold but I am sure the current asking price is nothing close to it.

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Tropicana Las Vegas - A DoubleTree by Hilton Hotel
Tropicana Las Vegas - A...
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Sarnia, Ontario
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60. Re: Discussion for Vegas veterans re: Non-gamblers

Mason can keep his money in Canada where there is no fun for gamblers. I'd rather take mine to Vegas where I can stay free, drink free and have alot more fun than here.

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